Washblog

Can anyone defend HB - 2895 / SB - 6707 ???

I received the email below from a friend and neighbor who is a self-employed interior decorator (Decorating Den). My wife and I are also customers.

It sure looks like an industry trade association lobbying Olympia to restrict competition under the guise of "public health & safety".

I don't know anything about this bill or the interior design industry. I'm interested in hearing both sides of the story. Please comment if you can shed some light on this issue.

My friend has a bachelor of fine arts degree, and 8 years experience as a professional. According to her, she would be disqualified to continue her business if this bill were to become law. That sounds pretty ridiculous to me.

     -SARGE

Dear Friends:

There are currently bills before the House and Senate that will soon be voted on that will put many small business owners out of business if they pass.  You can pull them up and read them with the information given below, but in a nutshell they will require anyone that assists in selecting fabrics, finishes, color, furniture layout and space planning, or any other interior design activities in a customer's home to have a four year Interior Design degree, pass many examinations, and be licensed by the state. This is an effort by the ASID to eliminate competition from many successful creative individuals, and a way for the state to make more money from licensing.   It will create a monopoly of sorts, as very few individuals currently working as interior designers and decorators meet the strict criteria.  It will also succeed in making interior design inaccessible to all but the wealthy.

The premise of the law is that selection of these sorts of finishes and products in a customer's home constitutes an issue of public health and safety.  This is incredibly ridiculous.  If it were limiting work on commercial public spaces such as hospitals, theaters, shopping centers, auditoriums, or other such spaces, I myself would support this law.  These sorts of venues should be overseen by engineers and architects and designers trained in the specific requirements for these spaces.  Those of us working in our client's homes helping to make their spaces more functional, more comfortable, and more aesthetically pleasing in no way pose a threat to public safety.  I would be happy if the law stated that proof of insurance or some sort of proficiency test be passed before individuals are allowed to work in clients homes, but that is not what this bill is about.  They are not taking into account any other type of training (such as that provided by a franchise company such as mine) or years of experience (12 in my case) with no complaints.  This law would fine someone and charge them with a misdemeanor if they did so much as helped select a color or fabric in someone else's home without a four year degree and proper licensing.  The other ridiculous element is that if you do the same work in a retail store, you are exempted from this law, and they require no training whatsoever.

There are plenty of laws in place to protect public safety. Interior Design and Architectural firms that do work in public spaces only hire the individuals that have the necessary degrees and experience to do that type of work. There is no need to severely restrict those of us in the interior design industry that are working in residences, are careful to perform our work in a responsible manner and hire licensed, insured contractors as our installers and fabricators. There was a study done, and several prominent Architectural firms wrote in that "there has never been any proof that the interior design industry is a threat to human health or safety". In my experience, those that have the four year degrees can sometimes be more dangerous as most of the ones I've met can't even calculate yardages or measure windows or anything else for themselves. They don't receive any of this training as part of their degree. Who cares how many classes you've taken in the psychology of color or how many codes you've memorized if you don't have the brains to figure out the mechanics of the job or the talent to pull a room together. That is why they are threatened, and that is why they are lobbying so hard for this bill.

Well, I'll get off my soapbox. I am just sending this out to my friends with the hope that you as consumers and members of the general public will read this bill, and call or write your legislators telling them how ridiculous it is, and ask them to oppose these bills. Your rights will be affected as well, as the price to obtain professional assistance with design projects will certainly escalate, and in my opinion, the quality will certainly not increase.

What I really think they should focus on are the products manufactured overseas for sale in this country for use in our homes and businesses. I would guess that many of the items made available for sale to not only ALL interior design professionals, but to the general public as well, could be toxic due to lead poisoning or other toxic chemicals and off-gassing. Interior Designers regardless of degree or experience have no way of knowing these imported products they are purchasing are safe, and neither do consumers.

Thank you for taking the time to read this. I sincerely appreciate any effort you might make to fight this legislation. Please feel free to pass this on if you feel so inclined.

[NAME & CONTACT INFO REDACTED!]

The following was forwarded to me, and has the info on contacting legislators at the bottom.

To all who live in Washington State,

I normally would not bring up politics, but I feel that a bill going through the Washington State Legislature right now is one you need to know about. Bill HB- 2895 / SB-6707 would strip away my ability to continue my design business. It would require that all interior designers become "registered" with the state and then presents only one pathway to obtain registration - a pathway with a list of criteria that the majority of professional designers in Washington State do not meet. Currently, only two schools in the state would meet the requirements for accreditation in the bill - leaving my Bachelor of Fine Arts and Masters degrees and 8+ years of experience meaningless (including almost 7 years as a business owner). Also, any other certifications - such as those from the National Kitchen and Bath Association -- would not be considered viable.

This bill puts hundreds, if not thousands, of people out of work. It is bad for everyone concerned as well as the economy. In 2005, this same cartel presented a similar licensing bill to the Washington State Legislature, which studied the industry through their "Sunrise Review" and determined that this registration was unnecessary. The bill is put forth as a way to "protect the health, safety and welfare" of the public, but in reality it is designed to limit competition in the design industry. The review is found at http://www.dol.wa.gov...

I NEED YOUR HELP. I've been calling my legislators and my senator but they need to hear from the "public" as well. They need to know that HB-2895 / SB-6707 is not needed to "protect" you from interior design - instead it restricts your access to interior design services. If the competition is limited, that is when the harm to the public will occur - in the form of restricted access and higher costs.

Please CALL your Legislators and Senator TODAY 1-800-562-6000 to give them the following message:

PLEASE OPPOSE HB-2895 / SB-6707.  IT IS UNNECESSARY BECAUSE NO HARM TO THE PUBLIC WAS PROVEN DURING THE DEPARTMENT OF LICENSING'S SUNRISE REVIEW PROCESS.  THE HARM TO THE PUBLIC WILL COME IF THIS BILL PASSES BECAUSE IT WILL RESTRICT OUR ACCESS TO INTERIOR DESIGN SERVICES AND INCREASE OUR COSTS.

Or EMAILyour Legislators & Senator by going to: http://apps.leg.wa.gov.... Enter in your district information and it will take you to an "EMAIL YOUR LEGISLATOR" link on the site.

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There are a lot of people, from the standpoint of somebody who ran into them in the context of working for a construction/trades contractor, who are doing interior design but who come imperceptibly close to being general contractors.

Of course, they don't possess a GC license.

You say there are plenty of laws in place to protect public safety... and the industries which are regulated, I might add... but I say to you that they are not enforced.

There are huge issues of public and worker safety, as well as fitness (manifested in companion bills mandating new construction/remodel fitness guarantees) which are involved.

This particular law seems like more of the same: it will not be enforced. It also seems like these designers could get GC licenses and that would be that.

At the same time, these people who are passing off as "designers" and who are really general contractors OUGHT TO FEEL THE FOOT OF GOVERNMENT STEPPING ON THEIR PROTUBERANCES if you get what I mean.

by m3047 on Sat Feb 02, 2008 at 12:38:55 AM PST

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I've been a housepainter for 21 years, and owned my own business for the past nine. Do I have a degree in interior design? No! Will I go get one? Not on your life!

I know more about paint finishes, toxic or otherwise, than any interior designer. Frankly, when a prospective client tells me their interior designer is going to choose the paint products I tell them to find another painter. The paint materials I use are part of the "tools of my trade" and after 21 years of hands-on work I don't need to be schooled on this. I know what I'm doing. I've been doing color consultation far too long to put up with this nonsense.

This is not a rant against all designers, just the ones who try and tell painters what to do and how to do it. I wouldn't ever  presume to tell an interior designer which fabrics or window coverings to sell their clients. It's none of my business.

You can bet my legislators will hear from me on this issue. These bills, if passed, will indeed, put thousands of good people out of work and destroy the interior trades industries -- which, by the way, put millions of dollars per year into the state coffers in the form of revenues.

Six years ago contractor insurance and bond rates increased 40% because of a few large claims brought against unscrupulous, or incompetent, contractors during the remodel boom of the late '90's. That legislation was written by the insurance industry and was given a wet kiss by Frank Chopp.

The state tries to squeeze self-employed contractors at every turn. It's hard enough to build a client base, get regular work, support oneself, pay all the bills, fees and taxes, AND TOTAL COST OF HEALTH INSURANCE to boot.

This is an attempt to force people into paying exhorbitant tuition fees. It won't work.

This is boneheaded legislation from every angle.

The legislature has 2000 bills to consider in this year's short session, and they're going to waste time trying to destroy our state economy with this crap?

Color me NOT surprised.

by shoephone on Sat Feb 02, 2008 at 02:46:59 PM PST

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Looking at the list of legislators who brought this law -- I'm sure that their motivation is protecting public health and safety.  And I don't doubt that there is a health issue here.  But, as Shoephone say, why not address it in a way that is targeted to solve that problem without harming so many independent business people?

I don't have any in-depth knowledge here, but this bill does strike me as one of those trade protectionism moves -- one group in a profession trying to do two things: first, squeeze out as many practitioners as possible so that there is less competition and, second, raise the level of competence and accreditation in the profession in order to raise its profile in the community.  

As a paralegal, I've seen this in the legal field where, depending on what state you live in, the attorney lobby keeps paralegals from doing work they are fully qualified to do -- and can do much less expensively than lawyers.  The history of the American Medical Association squelching midwifery in the United States is a classic -- and very ugly, example.  Then there are dentists organizing against allowing paraprofessionals to fit dentures. Etc.  

It looks like the Senate bill is scheduled for a public hearing on Tuesday, 2/5 -- tomorrow -- in the Senate Committee on Labor, Commerce, and Research & Development at 1:30 PM. (Subject to change)

by noemie maxwell on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 09:01:00 AM PST

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http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/APWires/wastate/D8UKHRO84.html

I called Kohl-Welles office on Monday and, apparently, so did a whole lot of other people. Then they heard in-person testimony on the floor of the Senate. Hopefully, this bill never sees the light of day again.

by shoephone on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 02:28:50 AM PST

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I think that's the basic question.

If a person claims to be an Interior Designer and there is a professional standard for that, I think it's reasonable for a customer to know whether the person does or does not meet that professional standard.

Washington state, with its libertarian tendencies, has a very narrow definition of "harm".

But consider this: a person is not harmed by eating "organic" food that is slightly less than organic. But is a person defrauded?

I don't know the profession, but I think it's reasonable to ask businesses not to make claims that aren't true. Clearly there is some agreed upon value to the training an Interior Designer gets. If a business person can't deliver that value, then there are other words than can be used to describe what value they can give.

by dlaw on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 11:53:01 AM PST

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